tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21823280.post6189894791045259601..comments2024-03-20T19:13:08.222+00:00Comments on Jonathan Wallace: Will Brown introduce AV?Jonathan Wallacehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/12335108244369275069noreply@blogger.comBlogger9125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21823280.post-62450448808436911322007-01-18T07:43:00.000+00:002007-01-18T07:43:00.000+00:00Jonny: STV - even with 2 member constituencies - i...Jonny: STV - even with 2 member constituencies - is proportional, AV is not. The reason for that is at it's heart mathematical. I'm sorry that doesn't fit your world view, but that isn't really my problem.James Graham (Quaequam Blog!)https://www.blogger.com/profile/00319089107820032874noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21823280.post-26813025253557957202007-01-17T10:30:00.000+00:002007-01-17T10:30:00.000+00:00Heather! Now I know where you are. India!!!!! N...Heather! Now I know where you are. India!!!!! Not been there before but it's on my list of places to visit!<br /><br />I'll have to dig up those photos from 1994 when you, me, a certain Sarah Girling and a bunch of Lib Dems painted the streets of Newcastle red one weekend.Jonathan Wallacehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12335108244369275069noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21823280.post-29738702236530750732007-01-17T10:12:00.000+00:002007-01-17T10:12:00.000+00:00Yes I can claim that STV and AV are mathematically...Yes I can claim that STV and AV are <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alternative_vote#Terminology">mathematically the same.</a><br /><br />You're right: they have very different effects to each other, STV is proportional and AV is not. <br /><br />However, they use exactly the same procedure to calculate the quote, and to tranfer votes. Trust me, I've run in, and helped to organise, lots of Jonny Wrighthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07414994559548890103noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21823280.post-42746142012276016712007-01-16T20:16:00.000+00:002007-01-16T20:16:00.000+00:00Goodness me .... this all sounds horribly familiar...Goodness me .... this all sounds horribly familiar .... am I interested ..?? nooooooo ..... am I interested in knowing what you're up to, poppet??? yeeeeessss!!!Heatherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07363600965062727439noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21823280.post-25200854055193148212007-01-16T14:35:00.000+00:002007-01-16T14:35:00.000+00:00Jonny, you are wrong to say that it is no less pro...Jonny, you are wrong to say that it is no less proportional than FPTP. In many cases, see Australia for an example, it is less proportional precisely because of the way it distorts swings.<br /><br />In 1997, it was calculated that under AV, Labour's already over-representative majority would have been even larger, precisely because so many people were voting for "anyone but the Tories".<br /><James Graham (Quaequam Blog!)https://www.blogger.com/profile/00319089107820032874noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21823280.post-91254225651180722082007-01-16T14:10:00.000+00:002007-01-16T14:10:00.000+00:00I have to agree with James here.
We should not acc...I have to agree with James here.<br />We should not accept AV as a bargaining chip - we should hold out for at least some STV for coalition purposes. (Jeremy Thorpe's suggestion of AV for large rural seats with low population and STV for urban/suburban areas is a possibility).<br /><br />We should not oppose AV if Labour brought it in. AV isn't PR, but its a step in the right direction and Tristanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15395992764678278326noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21823280.post-558086577695137312007-01-16T14:03:00.000+00:002007-01-16T14:03:00.000+00:00I'm a big STV fan, but I think on balance, AV woul...I'm a big STV fan, but I think on balance, AV would be an improvement on what we currently have. It's not proportional, but it's certainly no less proportional than FPP. As you say, it would have the advantages of making voting more relevant, and forcing political parties to campaign more widely and in a more relevant way. <br /><br />AV is mathematically almost exactly the same as STV, it's justJonny Wrighthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07414994559548890103noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21823280.post-85270539958480144672007-01-16T13:28:00.000+00:002007-01-16T13:28:00.000+00:00It isn't a question of purity, it's a question of ...It isn't a question of purity, it's a question of whether AV is a good system or not.<br /><br />The problem with it is that it exaggerates swings. Labour are calculating that this will mean an exaggerated swing against the Conservatives (at Labour Conference last year, senior Labour figures were queuing round the block to say how they thought AV was a Good Idea), but it could just as easily workJames Graham (Quaequam Blog!)https://www.blogger.com/profile/00319089107820032874noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21823280.post-46410188698253448202007-01-16T13:19:00.000+00:002007-01-16T13:19:00.000+00:00I think he too will change the voting system. He h...I think he too will change the voting system. He has to. Brown will have to do something radical to "bump up" Labour. And if we believe the lastest predictions, we will see a hung parliament and we will be party that everyone will be turning too. <br /><br />Its also interesting to note that Cameron is flirting with PR.Liberal Republicanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15494973255399870603noreply@blogger.com